I'd like to first say thanks to those who checked out that 1911 pic I posted. I should have waited until I get the good pics from the photographer but I just couldn't wait....like a kid at Xmas. After watching the photographer for a couple of hours - the scaffolding of lights, backgrounds, and incredible feat of engineering just to get the shots he wanted I was able to quickly justify his bill for services. Anyway those will be up in place of the original in a few days.

As for my question. Re-investment is always a good idea especially when the investment is a smart one. I am putting a project to paper that would work perfectly on a Henry or 1873 Winchester. Of course I'm not about to touch an original but would a $1000 Uberti replica be worthy of months of work??? I've seen some incredible work done on replicas by great engravers but I'm not sure if those particular pieces remained in the engravers personal collections or if not, was the engraver actually able to recover his/her investment (timewise) considering it is a replica?

Christopher Malouf
1/20/2007 10:50:13 PM

this is a very intelligent question. do you know your "market" ? not someone elses. your market may be vastly different from that of other engravers. have you developed a market for your work ? yes, you have to develop a market for your work. that is to say, at least lots of people must become aware of your talent. it also helps if they're lookin to buy ! there are actually fools out there that attend gun shows that pay engravers to embellish their guns! the trick is to spot these folks before some other engraver does ! some other engraver might engrave a toy pistol and get a good price. you might do a job on a very fine firearm and find difficulty getting the price of the gun back, let alone the value of your work. so the realistic answer to this question must really come from you. you may be really good, but what if nobody knows it ? personally i would never engrave a gun unless it were by customer request. i would make an exception for a sample piece to show people. it's always nice to have a piece to show when the time is right.

j.d. swartzfeger
3/13/2007 12:50:04 AM

Hi Chris

I'm in the same boat as you. My next project is going to be a Uberti 44 cap n ball revolving carbine.

Something worth thinking about is what John Barraclough suggested to me. That is getting the woodwork redone and putting on a high class stock. The woodwork on Uberti's at the end of the day is still a commercial grade. At least that way you have a class/ custom made gun from start to finish and perhaps something a bit more saleable.

The down side to that is of course it's a lot more money.

At least if you don't sell it you would have one helluva gun to show friends, family and clients :-)

I'd be keen to hear other peoples ideas on this one as well.

Cheers
Andrew



Andrew Biggs
3/13/2007 4:47:58 PM

Andrew and Chris

I think that John B gave you some good advice on your future project. It will enhance the value of the completed project. When time comes that you want to sell it, it will be more desirable to future buyers and thus will sell faster. Same thing goes for pistol grips.

Mike

Robert Bissell
3/13/2007 5:36:11 PM

One thing to consider is the style of the engraving. You may want to research period styles of engraving to put on a Uberti replica, and find someone to properly redo the metal finishes, as well as the wood. A rust blue/color case job with a nice period style engraving job will do much more for your gun than some more modern style of engraving with a hot blue on it.

Take care,

Tom

F. McArdle
3/16/2007 11:26:31 PM

Andrew and Chris.
You might want to check with an Uberti distributor.
Uberti makes a lot of their guns as upgraded models.
Some are engraved or photo engraved in Italy.
These usually have higher grade stocks or grips.
Buying one of these factory made upgrades stocks as replacements might fill the bill and be less costly than a full custom made one.
Good wood is important on an engraved gun as you know.
Otherwise it's like a bride in a wedding dress and tennis shoes.
Just my thoughts. Best of luck with these projects.
John.


John Barraclough
3/17/2007 1:26:28 PM

Thanks for all that.

Funny how great minds think alike. John B and Mike Bissell both mentioned the upgrade models that Uberti offer. I'm looking into that right now as it could save a whole lot of shagging around.

Thanks Tom for that as well. Up till now all I've really given a lot of thought to is the designs and actual engraving. After attending Reno and staying with John, it's become apparent that the prep work and finish are just as important as anything else. They can either enhance or ruin the gun.

The only problem I have with the colour case finish is that it seems to detract from the actual engraving. I've seen a lot of photos in books where it's almost impossible to see the engraving and I'm never sure if that's just the photo that's the problem. Marty had a beautiful photo of a gun where he had brought back the coloour with a toilet cleaner.

Again I'd be interested to hear other peoples thoughts on this.

The whole topic of engraving is a huge subject isn't it!!! One thing seems to constantley lead to another.

Cheers
Andrew

Andrew Biggs
3/19/2007 7:51:57 PM

Andrew,
As you said case colors or bluing doesn't do much to enhance engraving or scene work. You'll find many an engraving job photographed "in the white" for that reason. I like to use French Gray for that reason on many guns. For period guns however, you'll have to deal with the case color. As Marty did, you can gray the areas of a scene if you like.
If you want to French Gray, John B has the formula for that.
Who said it would be easy?????
:)


Rex Pedersen
3/19/2007 9:24:59 PM

Andrew. If you remember the unfinished Colt I had at the show..when I finish finally the figures on it, I am going to have it plated. The finish I like to use is a hard satin chrome called Metalife. I've done a number of guns this way, some which you saw in Reno. It holds up great and it doesn't detract from the engraving. I should have the cowgirls fully engraved on the gun in time for Reno. I will call it my GIRLIE gun

Martin Rabeno
3/20/2007 1:03:25 PM

Hey, just checking back - took a couple of weeks in Boston and on my trip up AND back I stopped in to see Ron Nott!!! He's the first engraver to see my work and that I've met in person since I started 2.5 years ago. I learned alot and look forward to visiting him again. It was a great boost of confidence and knowledge for me. Ron's totally genuine in every way.

I asked Ron this same question. I had also posted it on the engraver' cafe forum. I haven't checked the cafe since Martin answered that post. He not only said "You engrave what you have." but when you engrave something for investment, you engrave the real thing by investing in a Winchester etc. that wouldn't lose value if restored. Ron's reply was almost, word for word, exact. I have had to think about this alot because in my mind is an image of what I think is a great idea. For the most part, that is where it must remain to stay a great idea....There is stuff that I need to engrave for fun and stuff to engrave in a well thought out manner. Projects that I think are "pretty cool" are now in the "for fun" folder and others require a great deal more research.

Andrew...I've got a Uberti carbine too!! I went to Taylor's and Co. a few years back and picked out one with a nice stock but they are all basically the same - commercial. This is definitely in my "cool" projects folder but I realize now that it's something I'll never recover my $$ on. I've also got a Uberti 1858. Soon I plan on converting both to 45 Colt (I'm fascinated by the cartridge conversion period) using a permanent conversion setup. R.L.Millington's the guy to talk to regarding historically accurate conversions. Then I'm going to engrave and silver inlay both to match - even the spare cartridge cylinders for my Pale Rider gun belt. Between both guns, spare cartridge cylinders, conversion setup, reblueing and the handmade gunbelt, I'm looking at about $2000. That doesn't include the engraving - luckily I can get that done for free. It's purely a "fun" project and one that I'm crazy enough to dump $$$ into. I could never get my money back but I guess it doesn't matter if you love it and want to keep it??? It's one of those things that I'll take to a show and the majority of passers by would say: "Nice work, but why did you engrave that?" The one guy that's says "Hey that's cool" will become a friend for life!

Christopher Malouf
3/21/2007 12:20:49 AM

One more thing...

I had all but given up on my Uberti Henry project. I actually started looking for an old '73 but it really needs to be on a Henry. With the suggestions regarding upgrading the wood, that might be just the ticket. A week to sleep on it and a $1000 bucks burning a hole in my pocket may make this a reality. Thanks again.

Christopher Malouf
3/21/2007 12:33:52 AM

Thanks for that Rex and Marty.

Chris...this will be a fun project (of sorts)it will be my first "real gun" that fires when I've finished it. Everything up till now has been bits of gun. I never really thought about the end sale as I probabley don't see one. I figure that I'm still in the learning catergory and if there's any stuff up's then it won't be a national/financial disaster. It should also give me more of the experience/confidence I really need for paying jobs. It's also tied up with the New Zealand gun licences. This is the closest I can come to engraving a handgun untill I get the appropriate licence from the police.

Cheers
Andrew

Andrew Biggs
3/21/2007 1:57:11 AM

hi Chris .. i am glad to hear that you made it back safe . and you are welcome to come back any time you want . i hope i was able to show you how to do the engraving things that you want to do ,and your work is great for just engraving for 2.5 years keep it up and call at anytime .. ron p.

Ron Nott
3/22/2007 9:21:02 AM

Ron, Thanks again for everything. Those photos we took came out great. They will be a great reference for taking my scrollwork to the next level. I'm going to follow up on your suggestions regarding tool preferences as well. All this time I thought tool breakage was because of my "iron thumb"!!! Another mysterious law of physics surrounding my benchtop dispelled.

Hi Andrew - regarding the carbine - start with the cylinder - they are easily replaced at only $50/ea. Glad I did one of my Uberti's that way. I've got a couple of interesting paper weights now. :)

Christopher Malouf
3/22/2007 8:58:45 PM